一、如何认识谈判？ a、How to understand the negotiations？

　　张文强：思想智慧，商界传奇，欢迎大家关注《商界非常道》，我是张文强。今天是我们《商界非常道》商务谈判系列的第一集，我们也邀请到了商务谈判培训界方面的专家李老师来跟我们一起共同策划这个系列，我们李老师今天给我们策划的主题有意思，叫做“拒绝谈判”，所以我就在想我们做商务谈判系列的第一集，但是听这个题目好象最后一集的感觉。

ZhangWenJiang：Ideological wisdom，Business legend，Welcome everybody attention《Business very way》，I am ZhangWenJiang。Today is our《Business very way》Business negotiation series of the first set，We also invited to the business negotiation training bound expert miss li to join us common planning this series，Today we miss li to give us planning theme interesting，called“Refused to negotiate”，So I think we do business negotiation series of the first set，But listen to this topic like the last set feeling。

　　介绍一下今天来跟我们一起分享的两位嘉宾老师，一位是李力刚，李老师，李老师是国内商务谈判培训界非常权威的专家，李老师有非常丰富的实战经验，而且培训经验也非常丰富，李老师的商务谈判的培训给我们留下了非常深刻的印象，尤其是跟我们搜狐渊源很深，我记得我们的搜狐职场一言堂第一期专题就是李老师，现在搜狐职场一言堂已经是第100期了，做一下广告，是这样一个情况，所以跟李老师也是很熟悉了，李老师为什么要想这么一个题目，到时候要解释一下。

Introduce today to share with us the two guests the teacher，One is LiLiGang，Miss li，Miss li is the domestic business negotiation training bound very authoritative experts，Mr Li has very rich experience in actual combat，And training experience is also very rich，Miss li's business negotiation training left us a very deep impression，Especially with we sohu deep origin，I remember our sohu workplace YiYanTang first phase project is miss li，NOw sohu workplace YiYanTang is already 100 period，Do the advertising，Is such a situation，So with miss li is very familiar with，Miss li why want to such a topic，When the time comes to explain。

　　李力刚：没问题。

LiLiGang：no problem。

　　张文强：因为我想很多朋友还在想怎么去学习谈判，但是您已经到了拒绝谈判的境界了，这很有意思。另外今天也请到了李老师的一个好朋友，也是我们搜狐的好朋友，是刘博老师，刘博老师是知名的IT人士，是原微软中国的副总经理，而且刘老师的经历是非常丰富的，可以简单地从我的了解介绍一下刘博老师，刘博老师历经是国企、民企、外企，然后刘博老师曾经经历过销售、市场、高层管理，所以各方面经历很多，刘老师跟大家认识一下，然后我想先重复一下话题，就是您是怎么认识这个谈判的。

ZhangWenJiang：Because I think a lot of friends in want to how to learn our talks，But you have to refuse to negotiate the border，This is very interesting。In addition today also please to miss li's a good friend，Also we sohu's good friend，Is LiuBo teacher，LiuBo teacher is well-known IT experts，Is original Microsoft China's deputy general manager，And the experience of liu is very rich，Can simply from my understanding to introduce LiuBo teacher，LiuBo teacher after is state-owned enterprises、corporation、foreign，Then LiuBo teacher once experienced sales、market、Top management，So the experience a lot of，Teacher liu with everyone to meet，Then I'd like to repeat the topic，Is how did you know this negotiation。

　　刘博：从我开始。

LiuBo：Since I started。

　　张文强：从您开始。

ZhangWenJiang：You start from。

　　刘博：一说谈判说实话，其实我感觉有点怕，因为谈判是一个非常累的活，是一个很艰苦的工作。

LiuBo：Said negotiations to tell the truth，In fact I feel a little afraid，Because the negotiation is a very tired of live，Is a very hard work。

　　张文强：您为什么认为谈判很累呢？

ZhangWenJiang：Why do you think talks very tired？

　　刘博：其实很简单，因为谈判本身是一种利益的较量，实际上谈判双方都期望用最小的代价换取最大的价值。

LiuBo：Actually very simple，Because negotiations itself is a kind of contest of interests，In fact the negotiations both sides are expected to use the least cost for the biggest value。

　　张文强：所以谈判是一个博弈的过程。

ZhangWenJiang：So negotiations is a process of game。

　　刘博：是一个博弈的过程，所以整个谈判是一个斗智斗勇，勾心斗角，十八般武艺经常要耍出来，而且有的时候比较重要的谈判可能会用很长的时间。

LiuBo：Is a game process，So the whole negotiation is a battle of wits DouYong，Intrigue against each other，Legendary weapons of China often wants to play out，And sometimes more important negotiations might use a long time。

　　张文强：就是劳心劳力。

ZhangWenJiang：Is headwork labor。

　　刘博：对，可能我们这些做过销售，尤其是做过一些比较大的case，大部分都经过所谓的“马拉松”式谈判，谈到最后大家连说话的力气都没有。

LiuBo：to，May we these done sales，Especially done some larger case，Most have been called“marathon”Type negotiations，When it comes to the last we even talk to strength are not。

　　张文强：已经是筋疲力尽的感觉。

ZhangWenJiang：Is already exhausted feeling。

　　刘博：这是我对谈判的第一个感觉。

LiuBo：This is my first feeling to the negotiations。

　　李力刚：还有就是经常造成这个要么伤钱，要么伤人。

LiLiGang：There is often causing the money or injury，Or hurt。

　　刘博：最后谈完了以后大家都够伤气的。

LiuBo：Finally talk about after all the injury is angry enough。

　　张文强：不过李老师有一个观点，李老师认为谈判是生活化的内容，他说谈判无处不在，李老师您是怎么认识谈判的？因为您是专门研究谈判的,我的理解是这样，假如您像刘老师一样认为谈判是一件很痛苦的事，您就不会坚持到现在，继续再教谈判，乐此不疲，咱们的观点可能不一样。

ZhangWenJiang：But Mr Li has a point of view，Miss li think negotiation is the content of the life，He said negotiations everywhere，Miss li you is how understanding negotiations？Because you are a special study of the negotiations,My understanding is that，If you like as liu that negotiation is a very painful，You would not insist on until now，Continue to teach negotiations，happy，Let's point of view may be different。

　　李力刚：因为中国的发生过菲律宾人质事件，香港的游客事件，在美国有一个电影叫《王牌对王牌》，故事几乎跟菲律宾人质事件一模一样，其中这里有一个谈判专家说一句话，我连老婆、孩子都搞不定，我还其跟别人谈判，谈啥呢！其实你会发现，商场谈判成功的人未必生活上得意，所以商场得意，可能情场失意，所以无论我们谈恋爱也好,找老婆也好，还是到后来教育孩子也好，都这样。

LiLiGang：Because China's happened hostage event in the Philippines，Hong Kong tourists event，In the United States have a movie called《Ace to ace》，The story with the Philippines almost hostage event as like as two peas，Among them there is a negotiation experts say a word，I didn't even wife、Children make uncertain，I have the negotiations with others，Talk about what?！In fact you will find，Market negotiation successful people don't necessarily life satisfied，So market proud，May be unlucky in love，So whatever we fall in love all right,Seek a wife or，Or to later education children all right，All such。

　　张文强：所以谈判是无处不在的。在您生活当中有没有遇到过比较精采的谈判案例和大家分享一下。

ZhangWenJiang：So negotiations is everywhere。In your life ever get is wonderful negotiations case and share with you。

　　李力刚：生活里吗？

LiLiGang：Life?？

　　张文强：都可以，刘老师也准备一下。

ZhangWenJiang：can，Teacher liu also to prepare。

　　李力刚：因为中国一个著名的汽车品牌，09年，这个老总是总裁班的班长，她非常着急打电话给我，她打了我5次电话，结果我在上课，没接到，后来她说李老师帮个忙，我在北京谈判，他们跟非洲人谈，结果谈到现在为止我们出现一个现象，我们的供应商已经跟客户报价了，今天汽车和电脑是可以拼的，供应商也能拼出汽车，你在非洲卖的汽车可以不打某品牌的logo，因为他们买的就是中国不知名品牌，所以供应商报价之后，非洲的客户说如果你价钱不搞得跟供应商差不多，我们就再也不要了，这个时候这位老总非常着急给我打电话，我们通了大概一个多小时电话，我们想了一套策略，后来我发现她在第二天晚上9点多的时候，是位女老总，很兴奋给我打电话说李老师我成功了，这个事情给我感觉最有成就感。因为后来她又介绍了好多来上总裁班的课，所以我在华科大的时候就曾经有幸听过5、6次一模一样讲谈判的课程。

LiLiGang：Because China is a famous brand of car，09，The manager is the monitor of class President，She is very anxious to call me，She gave me five times on the phone，As a result, I in the class，missed，Then she said Mr Li do me a favor，I am in Beijing negotiations，They're talking about Africa，The results talked about now we have a phenomenon，Our suppliers have to offer customers，Today's cars and computers can be the spell，The supplier can spell out cars，You in Africa sell cars can not play a brand logo，Because they buy is China does not well-known brand，So after supplier offer，Africa's customer said if you prices do not make almost with suppliers，We will never the，This time the old total very anxious to give me a call，We through the probably more than a hour telephone，We want to a set of strategies，Then I found her in the next day when the 9 o 'clock at night，Is a female manager，Very excited to call me say miss li I succeeded，The things I feel the most sense of accomplishment。Because she later introduced to better the class President of the class，So I university in China when he had the opportunity to listen to five、6 times the same talks about the course。

　　张文强：您好象乐在其中，好像跟您的感觉都不一样，我想问您，您为什么感觉很痛苦？是不是经历过很痛苦的经历？

ZhangWenJiang：You seem to enjoy it，As with your feeling is different，I want to ask you，Why do you feel very painful？Is experienced very painful experience？

　　刘博：其实我刚才讲痛苦主要是在商业谈判，但是刚才李老师讲过程是痛苦的，但是如果谈成了，成就感其实很强。从另外一个角度说，我完全赞成李老师刚才讲的生活和工作，其实谈判无所不在，我有另外一个观点，跟李老师的观点可能正好可以补充。实际人的一辈子遇到很多人，然后会发现这里面几乎所有人都是你的客户。

LiuBo：Actually I just speak pain mainly in business negotiation，But just miss li speak process is painful，But if negotiate，A sense of accomplishment in fact is very strong。From another perspective，I entirely approve of Mr Li just speak of life and work，In fact negotiations omnipresent，I have another point of view，With Mr Li's point of view may be just can be added。The actual people life met a lot of people，Then will find it almost everyone is your customer。

　　张文强：这个观点很独特，所有人都是，换句话说，您跟所有人都要进行谈判。

ZhangWenJiang：This view is very unique，All men are，In other words，You and everyone must carry on the negotiations。

　　刘博：实际上每天都会有谈判的情况出现，而且包括你的同事、朋友，当然我刚才说几乎，有一个排除在外。

LiuBo：In fact every day the negotiation occurs，And include your colleagues、friends，Of course I just said almost，There is a ruled out。

　　李力刚：是谁呢？

LiLiGang：? Who is？

　　刘博：子女，反正我绝对不跟我女儿谈判，她要什么，我给什么。

LiuBo：children，Anyway, I absolutely not with my daughter negotiations，What she wants to，I what to。

　　李力刚：几乎都是输的。

LiLiGang：Are almost lose。

　　刘博：跟她谈判一定是输的。

LiuBo：With her negotiations must be lose。

　　张文强：这是您的一种爱的表现。

ZhangWenJiang：This is your a love performance。

　　刘博：所以实际上生活中有很多这种谈判，比如你每天都要出去买东西，买菜，本身讨价还价是一个非常典型的谈判过程，好像只有两句话，但是它就是谈判。

LiuBo：So in fact life there are many this kind of negotiations，For instance you everyday want to go out to buy things，Buy vegetables，Itself bargaining is a very typical negotiation process，As if only two words，But it is a negotiation。

　　张文强：您提到这一点，我还想起一件事，听完李老师的课之后，回去跟我儿子说，你以后买东西千万记住几个砍价的秘诀，第一就是谁先说话谁先死，你不能先出价，然后问他这个最低卖多少钱，你不能先说，最后还有一个什么临门。

ZhangWenJiang：You mention it，I also thought of one thing，After hearing of miss li after lesson，Back to my son said，After you buy things must remember a few secret of bargain，The first is who first speaker who die first，You can't first bid，Then ask him the minimum sell how many money，You can't say first，Finally, there are a what rimmon。

　　刘博：我讲一句，你的这句话是谈判技巧的第一条，第一条叫永远不接收第一个offer。

LiuBo：I speak a word，You of this sentence is the first negotiation skills，Article 1 is called forever don't accept the first offer。

　　张文强：永远不接收第一个offer。

ZhangWenJiang：Never receive the first offer。

　　刘博：包括出offer的人和接offer的人都是一样的，所以你水平很高，一下就抓住重点了。

LiuBo：Including the offer and joint offer people are the same，So you level is very high，Once seized the point。

　　李力刚：刚才我还一直以为我要追求新发现，让天下的人都成为我们的客户，我发现原来刘总早就这么做了，为什么？其实今天我们在讲首先一定要把全天下的人变成客户，其次变成你的分销商。

LiLiGang：Just now I still thought I want to pursue new discovery，Let all the people to become our customers，I found that liu2 zong3 would have done so，why？Actually today we are talking about first must make the entire world of people into customers，Secondly into your distributors。

　　张文强：有机会分享一下您跟您爱人怎么谈判的。

ZhangWenJiang：Have the opportunity to share your love with you how negotiations。

　　李力刚：我经常谈不过她。

LiLiGang：I often talk about but she。

　　张文强：您谈不过您爱人，刘老师谈不过他女儿，看来我们都有天敌。

ZhangWenJiang：You talk about love but you，Teacher liu talk but his daughter，It looks like we have natural enemy。

　　李力刚：一物降一物。

LiLiGang：Everything has its vanquisher.。

　　张文强：两位都是谈判的高手，刘老师还是刚才那个话题，在您的这么多经历过程中有没有遇到一个让您印象特别深刻的谈判。

ZhangWenJiang：The two are the negotiations player，Teacher liu or just the topic，In your so much experience process have met a let you deep impression special negotiations。

　　刘博：有，那个时候很多类型的谈判，包括跟客户、合作伙伴、竞争对手，都会有很多，印象很深的记得有一次为了一个案子，大家谈到最后，谈判实质没有了，坐了二十几个人，然后谈到最后完全静默，3分钟没有一个人讲话。

LiuBo：have，At that time many types of negotiations，Including with the client、partners、competitors，Will have a lot of，Impression deep remember once to a case，We talked about last，Negotiations without the essence，Sit a more than 20 people，And then when it comes to finally complete silence，3 minutes no one speech。

　　张文强：黑色3分钟。

ZhangWenJiang：Black 3 minutes。

　　李力刚：最开始我以为这种情况只在我们谈判室里面的理论上成立。

LiLiGang：In the beginning I thought this kind of circumstance just in our negotiation room inside was established theoretically。

　　刘博：真的有，到那个时候大家所有的话已经说尽了，所有的招数都已经用尽的时候，还是不能谈得拢，而双方又期望这个事情能够做成，可是实在谈不下去了，这个时候出现你刚才讲的黑色3分钟，那个黑色3分钟对于每个在谈判室的人，尤其我当时还是主要谈判人，是一种超人的煎熬。

LiuBo：There really is，By that time we all words have eye，All of the move has run out of time，Still can't talk approach，And both sides and expect that the things can make it，But really talk about not bottom go to，This time you have just told appear black 3 minutes，The black 3 minutes for each in negotiation room person，Especially I was still the main negotiator，Is a superman of suffering。

　　张文强：我们大家很关心最后怎么打破黑色3分钟的。

ZhangWenJiang：All of us are concerned about how to break the black 3 minutes。

　　刘博：最后打破也简单，有一个人说了一句话，今天算了吧，明儿咱再说吧。

LiuBo：Finally break simple also，A man said a words，Today, forget it，Tomorrow I to say again。

　　张文强：合着就不谈了。

ZhangWenJiang：Eating is not talked about。

　　刘博：所以就不谈了。

LiuBo：So they don't talk about the。

　　李力刚：刘总为什么越来越厉害，那是因为他不断地在打怪升级。

LiLiGang：Liu2 zong3 why more and more severe，That's because he kept playing strange upgrade。

　　张文强：确实让我们知道，尤其是正式的商务谈判蛮难的，李老师您觉得谈判为什么这么难？

ZhangWenJiang：Really let us know，Especially formal business negotiations quite difficult，Miss li you feel negotiation why so difficult？

　　李力刚：因为谈判的核心是能量的博弈，是实力的博弈，谁的实力很强，谁的很弱，但是这个是作为实象存在的，但是一般人看不到它的本质，实象加本质，我们只能看到现象，因为现象一般有很多迷雾盖住，所以我们之前信息很难收集，就是我们没有收集或者收集不到等等，本来谈判是一个很简单的事结果搞得很复杂。

LiLiGang：Because the core of the negotiations is energy game，Is the strength of the game，Whose strength is very strong，Who is very weak，But this is as real as existing，But ordinary people can't see the essence of it，Real image and essence，We can only see phenomenon，Because phenomenon generally have a lot of fog cover，So we before information is very difficult to collect，Is that we have not collect or collected less than, etc，Originally negotiation is a very simple thing results make very complex。

　　张文强：所以很多表现得很艰难的谈判其实有可能是之前的准备工作没有准备到位，或者出现各种各样的。

ZhangWenJiang：So a lot of performance very difficult negotiations in fact may be prepared before work not ready to reach the designated position，Or appear all kinds of。

　　李力刚：我听过一个案例，一群日本人跟一群美国人谈判，谈判的时候，双方对立的时候，你们也知道谁喜欢讲话。

LiLiGang：I heard a case，A group of Japanese people to a group of American negotiations，When negotiations，When the opposition，You also know who like talking。

　　张文强：美国人喜欢讲话。

ZhangWenJiang：Americans like to speak。

　　李力刚：滔滔不绝以后就问日本人你们什么感觉，日本人说听不懂，带回去考虑，结果第二次派第二波过来谈，美国人又发言，问他们什么感觉，他说还是没怎么听懂，本来很简单的事被他们搞得很复杂，但是接下来你会发现，日本人在第三次的时候要求立马跟美国人谈判，美国人觉得别人什么都不了解，以为他们还没怎么听懂，这个是书上写的，这个是继珍珠港以后美国的第二次失败。

LiLiGang：Blatter later asked the Japanese what you feel，Japanese say don't understand，Back consider，Results the second sent the second wave come to talk about，Americans speak again，Ask them what felling，He said or did not understand，Originally very simple things they make is very complex，But then you will find，The Japanese in the third time requirements immediately with American negotiations，Americans think others what all don't understand，Think they still didn't understand，This is a book written，This is the second time the United States after Pearl Harbor of failure。

　　张文强：可能对日本人也是一个策略。

ZhangWenJiang：Might be in Japanese is also a strategy。

　　刘博：李老师讲的案例实际上是讲谈判中的一个大忌，谈判的一条大忌就是不听别人讲，只是自己讲。

LiuBo：Mr Li said the case is actually speak negotiations of the a big fear，Negotiation of a big fear is not listen to other people speak，Just myself。

　　张文强：了解，实际上美国人犯了一个错是在这儿。

ZhangWenJiang：understand，In fact American has made a mistake was in here。

　　刘博：是一个核心错误，因为美国人觉得自己老大，他总要把自己的观点或者需求强加到别人头上。

LiuBo：Is a core error，Because americans feel the boss，He always want to put his ideas or demand imposed to someone else。

　　李力刚：他觉得怎么出牌都无所谓。

LiLiGang：He felt that it doesn't matter how brand。

　　刘博：你听懂了吗？日本人在这件事情上很聪明，你说他没有听懂，他一定听懂了。

LiuBo：You understand?？The Japanese on the matter is very clever，You say he didn't understand，He must understand。

　　张文强：他认真听，认真分析，认真研究，然后最后一击而中。

ZhangWenJiang：He listened to，Careful analysis，study，Then the last straw and in。

　　李力刚：所以我们把这个现象，就是拨开迷雾看到本质，谈判的最大压力来自于信息不对称，所以谁先拿到信息，谁先收集信息，谁成为王者，所以普京是干啥的？

LiLiGang：So we put this phenomenon，Is through the mist see nature，Negotiation of the maximum pressure comes from information asymmetry，So who first to get information，Who first collect information，Who is the king，So Mr Putin is stem what of？

　　张文强：普京原来是收集信息的，所以他谈判成功概率比较高。

ZhangWenJiang：Mr Putin was collecting information，So he talks success probability is higher。

　　李力刚：他为什么敢强势，是因为他信息全部够了。

LiLiGang：Why did he dare to strong，Because he information all enough。