搜狐教育主持人许晓书（搜狐教育频道主编）： Sohu education host Xu Xiaoshu(, editor-in-chief of sohu education channel):首先请问罗厅长一个问题，你觉得中国大学处于什么阶段？所有高校都说要创办一流的大学，但是努力的方向是不是存在偏差？

First could you tell me of a problem,What do you think of China what phase are you in university?All colleges and universities are said to first-class university,But the direction of the efforts if there is a deviation?

罗崇敏（国家督学，云南省人民政府参事，前云南教育厅厅长）： Luo Chongmin(State superintendent,Yunnan province people's government adviser,Former director of the yunnan province department of education):首先应当肯定大学取得的丰硕成果。目前大学存在的问题是没有良知，我想还是要从反思、批判角度思考这个问题。我始终认为大学应该是大爱之学、大智之学、大任之学，就是要有大爱之心、大智慧、大责任，这样培养出来的人才既有创造能力，又有大爱之情怀，才可能有幸福人生。

First of all should be sure university achieved fruitful results.Problems existing in current university is no conscience,I want to or from the reflection/Critically thinking about the problem.I always think the university should be a great love of learning/Great wisdom of learn/She studies,,Is to have a big heart of love/Great wisdom/Big responsibility,Such a cultivated talents both creative ability,And have a great feelings of love,Can have a happy life.

　　当然说实话，今天的话题我还是比较没有资格回答，但是我有我的想法。我长期在地方做管理工作，曾在云南一所大学担任一年党委书记，后来又到教育厅工作几年，在教育岗位上深入调研、深入思考确实带来很多危机感：现在大学的官场化、学校的工程化、学术的事成化、学生情场化越来越严重。大学价值流失，有价无知，是大学灵魂的缺失。我们在大学需要经受灵魂洗礼、增长智慧，但是灵魂却不灵。

Of course the truth,Today's topic I not qualified to answer,But I have my idea.I do management work in place for a long time,Once a year at a university in yunnan province party secretary,And then work a few years to the department of education,In-depth research on education jobs/Deep thinking does bring a lot of sense of crisis:Now at the university of officialdom/The school of engineering/Chenghua's academic/Students love more and more serious.University of value loss,Marketable ignorance,Is the lack of university spirit.We need to undergo the soul baptism at university/Growth in wisdom,But the soul is ineffective.

　　大学里确实有很多学生，在四年学习之后对于自己到底该做什么感到很迷茫。我在搜狐微博现在有200多万粉丝，大学生经常在微博上问我，“罗厅长，我现在大三了，以后到底该做什么？”到了大学四年级还不知道自己将来做什么，表面上看好像是就业的危机，其实是价值的危机、是创造力的危机。

Do have a lot of students in a university,After four years study about exactly what should you do when you feel confused.I'm sohu weibo now has more than 200 fans,College students often ask me on weibo,"ROM of the,I am junior now,What to do later?"In college grade four also don't know what you do in the future,On the surface like the employment crisis,Is the value of the crisis/Is the crisis of creativity.

　　我们不能否认大学培养人才所取得的成果，但也要看到现在存在这“三化”问题，还有根本问题：没有良知。我说的意思是，我们要有大学灵魂建设、大学精神建设的紧迫感。

We can't deny the achievements of university talents training,But also should see there now"three"The problem,There is the fundamental problem:Have no conscience.I mean is,We must have the university spirit construction/University spirit of the construction of the sense of urgency.

搜狐教育主持人许晓书（搜狐教育频道主编）： Sohu education host Xu Xiaoshu(, editor-in-chief of sohu education channel):您刚才提到的弊端，我们先就“官本位”问题进行探讨。现在校园里充斥各种官场等级，这个现象是怎么形成的？

You've just mentioned,We will first"Ranking of"Discusses the problem of.Now the campus filled with various levels of officialdom,This phenomenon is how form?

罗崇敏（国家督学，云南省人民政府参事，前云南教育厅厅长）： Luo Chongmin(State superintendent,Yunnan province people's government adviser,Former director of the yunnan province department of education):我认为这是由国家制度所带来的。我们不要去指责大学校长、大学老师，因为整个国家制度是一个官本位的设计，如果取消大学行政化，大学对话的基础都没有。学校的官本位、行政化问题不能靠学校自身，也不能靠教育本身，而要靠国家顶层政治制度的设计改革，才有可能解决。它是我们的制度和我们国家一定时期的发展阶段、管理水平所决定的。

I think it is system of by the state.We don't go to blame the university President/University teacher,Because the design of the system is a ranking of the country,If cancel the university town,University foundation all have no dialogue.The school's ranking/Security administration problem not by the school itself,Can't rely on education itself,And want to rely on national top-level design of political system reform,Has it been possible to solve.It is our system and our country in a certain period of the development stage/Management level.

搜狐教育主持人许晓书（搜狐教育频道主编）： Sohu education host Xu Xiaoshu(, editor-in-chief of sohu education channel):刚才从罗厅长讲话来看，大学体制化、官僚化、商业化没有做减法的进程，那么请杨教授谈谈，大学改革的内部动力来自于哪里？

Just from the ROM of the speech,University of institutionalization/bureaucratic/The process of commercialization to do subtraction,So please to talk to professor Yang,The inner power of university reform come from?

杨东平（21世纪教育研究院院长，北京理工大学教育研究院教授）： Yang dongping(The 21st century education research institute,Beijing institute of technology professor of institute of education):中国大学最近三十年经历了两个发展阶段，90年代后的十多年以规模扩张为主，片面追求数量和规模的迅速增长，使大学教育的质量产生了严重的问题，造成学生、学校、用人单位都不满意的情况。最近几年正在进入新的发展阶段。从“十二五”规划到规划纲要，所有国家政策文件都说明这一点，强调以提高质量为重心的内涵式发展，而这本身也是高等教育发展的必然要求。

University of China in recent 30 years has experienced two stages of development,In the 90 s, after more than ten years is given priority to with scale expansion,One-sided pursuit of the rapid growth of the number and size,Make the quality of university education has a serious problem,Have students/The school/Unit of choose and employ persons are not satisfied with the situation.In recent years are moving into a new stage of development.From the"The 12th five-year"Planning to plan for,All national policy documents to illustrate the point,Stressed in order to improve the quality as the center of gravity of connotative development,And this is also the inevitable requirement of the development of higher education.

　　国家开展专项工程，包括近期刚启动的2011计划，强调培养创新人才，包括高等教育本科质量提升、卓越人才培养计划的工程，说明最近几年高校的改革主要着重在人才培养模式的层面上。

Countries to carry out special projects,Including the recently launched 2011 plan,Emphasis on cultivating innovative talents,Including the higher education undergraduate course quality of ascension/Outstanding talent training plan of the project,Shows that in recent years, mainly focus on the reform of colleges and universities in personnel training mode of level.

　　但是我们现在看到的很多问题，涉及到学校学术风气、价值观等等，很难通过这种工程在短时间改变，很大程度上这是一种社会风气对大学校园的侵袭。大学基本素质改革是滞后的，比如说我们的大学没有淘汰制，只要入读就肯定可以毕业。而我们知道，美国普通本科淘汰率可以达到30%—50%。没有淘汰率的大学不可能是高质量的大学，但是在中国，想要淘汰一个学生难上加难。功利主义对大学的影响非常严重，包括对教师的评价考核，用“每天查你下几个鸡蛋”来评价教师质量。最近国家也提出了“深化教育领域教学改革”任务，对此我们还是有很大的期望。

But now we see a lot of problems,Involved in the school academic atmosphere/Values, etc.,It is difficult to change in a short time in this project,To a large extent this is a kind of social culture on university campus.University of basic quality reform is lagging,Such as not disputable system in our universities,As long as attend graduate can certainly.And we know,The average American undergraduate elimination rate can reach 30%, 50%.No selective university can't be a high quality of the university,But in China,Want to eliminate one of the students even harder.Utilitarianism influence on university is very serious,Including the assessment on teachers' evaluation,use"Check your next few eggs every day"To evaluate the quality of teachers.Countries are also put forward recently"Deepening the teaching reform in education field"The task,We still have a lot of expectations.